Forum

[Chris [Stockport]]

=1= I have forgotten the correct (polite) reply when people look at either of my (Indian) bullets and say how nice it is to see one that's original / not a copy / proper. Etc. Can anybody help?

=2= To start an electric motor, you switch it on... obviously. But petrol, diesel etc require turning by something else, starter motor, kicking, spinning an aeroplane's propeller etc. Does anyone know of an internal combustion engine that can start without other aids. Maybe a squirt of fuel and spark at just the right moment, or something like that?

(I'm not planning to blow myself up, just curious.)

[windmill john]

Question 1 - Yes, I used to be bothered by that. I now say they are all original. The company is still going. It's the same bike with some different seals, bolts etc. Nit pickers stay away
If someone pushes it, you can say that when they moved tooling to India and then RE India started selling bikes back to England.... You then just stare

Question 2 - Can't help if you disqualify bumping it! If it started without help, wouldn't that be a perpetual motion engine!


John

[stinkwheel]

1) I tell them almost all the bullets were made in India but initially India was part of Britain so they were British. It's just India became a soverign nation part way through the production run.

2) There are a few ways where starting is achieved by pressurising the combustion chamber. For example cartridge start on some aero engines. I believe some engines have pneumatic start where you introduce compressed air into whichever is at TDC. I suppose they are both "other aids" although maybe no more so than forcibly introducing fuel?

I believe some of the "stop start" motors use an accumulator so as they spin down, the starter motor is reversed and charges a capacitor. the crank sensor stops the motor on the "sweet spot" and the accumulated power is then used to restart. Battery is not used after the initial start of the day. Again, not the same thing but interesting.

It is possible to pop a direct injection engine without a starter motor if it deliveres a squirt and spark with the engine at the correct position. People are actively researching this for the stop-start systems. https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... 7015587403

[trophyvase]

Interesting point.

As an internal combustion engine relies on combustion (there’s a clue) in order for it to operate and as that combustion depends on compression of gases there must be an external force that will allow the stationary engine to overcome the inertia in the system when the system is at rest.

The operation of an electrical engine is of course entirely different.

While the operation of a stream engine is different again being a system that incorporates the heat-source required to operate the engine.

Or am I talking nonsense again!!??

[Beezabryan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEurohAwrmA

[PeteF]

I suppose if you used a very volatile fuel and a spark at the right time you might get enough energy to start the engine without compression. The spark would have to occur well after tdc though for there to be enough fuel to do the job. Hydrogen ??

[black fingernail]

=1= Ask them what their bike is.
=2= I seem to have an inkling that old time chauffeurs, I cannot remember what car, as a party trick, used to stop their engines in such a way, that, as they turned on the ignition it would fire, saves having to use the starting handle, I suppose.

[stinkwheel]

=2= I seem to have an inkling that old time chauffeurs, I cannot remember what car, as a party trick, used to stop their engines in such a way, that, as they turned on the ignition it would fire, saves having to use the starting handle, I suppose.

I presume if it stopped with a cylinder charged and compressed, first tickle of a spark would give you a power stroke. Most systems wouldn't spark when turned on though.

[Wheaters]

=1= Ask them what their bike is.
=2= I seem to have an inkling that old time chauffeurs, I cannot remember what car, as a party trick, used to stop their engines in such a way, that, as they turned on the ignition it would fire, saves having to use the starting handle, I suppose.

I read that Rolls Royce Silver Ghost chauffeurs could do it by moving the manual advance/retard and I think by operating a “trembler” coil. On a 12 cylinder engine there was a good chance that one cylinder was just over TDC and in a position to kick the engine over.

[black fingernail]

I read that Rolls Royce Silver Ghost chauffeurs could do it by moving the manual advance/retard and I think by operating a “trembler” coil. On a 12 cylinder engine there was a good chance that one cylinder was just over TDC and in a position to kick the engine over.
[/quote]
I think that is the one, but I wouldn't think it would do it from cold.