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By papasmurf
#92300
trophyvase wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 8:36 am
Is it very different with car dealers? Are they any more reliable by-and-large?
I don't know - it's a question.
And what about builders/plumbers/electricians/doctors/police/politicians?

:(
The media/press can't be trusted, and as for tradesmen, I have got fed up with having to do do work my self because trustworthy competent tradesmen seem to be as rare as rocking horse poo, and Unicorns.
One of the few exceptions is the motorcycle mechanic I use, he is excellent and goes about and beyond the call.
By Andy C
#92306
Seems that we live in a bodgeit and scarper society.

Once you know a good mechanic / plumber / electrician / builder it pays to stick with them.

Other half called in a plumber in an emergency once when I was away working, workmanship was apauling - I ended up "fixing the fix".

A lot of youngsters are just not interested in the trades so no one being trained properly.

Sad sign of the times.
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By trophyvase
#92307
You’re right Andy – but I don’t think it was ever any different. Certainly I’ve heard all these comments my whole life-long – it was no different in the 1950s.

In fact with legislation it is now in some ways (but only some ways) better than it was.

But I agree entirely with the point being made – it’s not good enough and ought to be better.
Will it ever be better? You know the answer to that as well as I do!!! :?
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By windmill john
#92308
Problem with plumbing, if you’re not touching gas, anyone can say they’re a plumber.

Don’t get me wrong, there are some self taught guys who are very good, it’s just the ones who have changed a washer and think, hey, I can do this.

Just remember what a professional is. If you earn more than 51% of your salary from a job, you can say you’re a professional. I don’t like that.
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By Wheaters
#92309
Plumbers....

Some friends who until recently lived (they've since moved) on a new housing estate close to us suffered three mains water bursts. Pipework inside walls on the top floor came apart on each occasion. It cost thousands to repair.

Reason? The so-called trained plumbing technicians who installed the pipework used push fit plastic joints. They obviously didn't know that to make these joints water tight you have to rotate a collar to lock it. So they hadn't.... Cold water pressure variations kept blowing the joints off the pipes.

We had a new condensing combi boiler fitted. As part of the job we had thermostatic valves fitted to some existing radiators. They sent two plumbers. One of them came to me to tell me we needed at least five new radiators. I knew they were fine so I asked him to show me what the problem was. He said it was because he couldn't undo the bleed valves. He put his bleed key in the first radiator and showed me it wouldn't undo the valve. I got my own key and easily undid the valve. He had the wrong key - it was recessed at the business end which meant it didn't connect with the squared end of the valve innards. I took it off him, went out to garage, put it in my bench vice and filed the recessed part off the end in about twenty seconds. I then took it back to him, put it in the radiator and opened the bleed valve and bled the air out.

He seemed amazed. I then asked him why, in any case, he couldn't have offered to replace the bleed valves, rather than replace the entire radiators. He said he didn't know you could do that.... Really?

Then, they ran the water and gas pipes to the new boiler diagonally across the utility room wall from bottom to top, rather than horizontally across the floor to the opposite corner where they could be boxed in. I complained about that and they sent a different plumber out to rectify it. The "repair" job was very poorly done. A friend, who had been a properly time served plumber visited us by chance some weeks later. He took one look and told me he'd do a proper job for the price of the materials and a cup of tea if 'd be his labourer. So we fixed it together.

Four or five years ago we decided to fit a wood burning stove to provide extra heat to the north wall of our bungalow; it needed to go right at the end of the corridor between two bedrooms. I obtained the building regulations and using them as guidance made a compliant hearth and surrounds so all that was needed was to install the pre-made flue which had to go up through the loft and out above the roof. I asked a local HETAS "engineer" for a price to install it and then sign the installation off, to make it compliant with the building regulations. He came round, tutted for a long time, saying how tricky this installation was going to be, could take days, etc, etc. He later sent me a quote of £1300 plus VAT, which was a lot more than I'd paid for the stove and installation kit. I nearly choked on my cornflakes.

I decided later that day to complete the job (all legal if you get it signed off by a qualified person, either a HETAS engineer or the council buildings department. I began the job at 4 pm and less than four hours later it was all fitted and smoke tested. The biggest part of the job was cutting out part of a loft joist to allow the flue to go through the ceiling and boxing a new load bearing frame around it. The upper part of the flue went through the roof very easily, all I had to do was remove one tile and fit the weather sealing sleeve and collar to the pipe. I then booked the local council building inspector to inspect it, sign it off and supply a compliance certificate, which cost about £112. I jokingly told my wife I might take a HETAS course and begin installing wood burners so I could also charge innocent punters £400 per hour plus VAT....
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By PeteF
#92311
I earned my living as an odd job man for a few years. Lost count of the number of times I recut tap seats after "plumbers" had said new taps were required. I once fitted an overhaul kit to a Mira shower (20 quid and an hour work) after "plumbers" had said the wnole thing was scrap. I once found a newly installed kitchen sink with the waste plumbed uphill!
I could go on all day.
Ordinary plumbing repairs (not heating etc) requires very little skill these days with modern fittings.
How many plumbers could sweat a lead pipe joint I wonder. I've never tried but I once sweated copper onto lead - it wasn't pretty but it worked.
By Andy C
#92312
It really annoys me how plumbers and electricians call themselves "engineers", they are not engineers, they are tradesmen.

If they have a degree then fair enough, but bet the most of them have just a city and guilds (or whatever the equivalent is these days), or in the case of most of the bodgers, probably no qualifications.

Things are not going to change, glad that I can do most stuff myself, trading standards seem to do FA even if you report them, and if caught they just setup another business.
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By OldBoy67
#92316
papasmurf wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:40 pm
PeteF wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:42 pm

How many plumbers could sweat a lead pipe joint I wonder.
I hope none because lead piping should have been removed decades ago.
In your dreams. My son says he frequently encounters lead pipes in houses built before 1970 in the course of his work.
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By Wheaters
#92317
About six years ago I was cajoled into a major refurbishment of the bathroom in the 1930s house my son had just bought. We pulled out thick walled lead water piping that must have weighed almost a hundred pounds. It had been disconnected but was lying under the floorboards. My son took it to the scrappy and weighed it in and earned himself quite a few quid!

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